

The Highlight Video, and Some Things You May Want to Pay Attention To
By: Laurie | October 31st, 2009Highlight video, with some things you may want to look at:
1:00 — Damn, we got lucky here.
1:22 — ditto, but I think Keller would have had it covered if it had been on target.
1:34 — this is the first time Onstand shoved Montero. (Note that Montero does NOT go down.) It takes place about a minute-and-a-half before The Other Incident. Also, is Onstad’s preoccupation with Montero one of the reasons that Mullan is the one who ends up having to clear Ianni’s header off the line? (Hmmm… Wondering if Fredy can get under Onstad’s skin again next Sunday?)
1:50 — The Other Incident, which has been discussed to death here and elsewhere. (The TV replay — not shown in the highlights — also shows that nobody came near Onstad’s face.)
2:02 — the best replay angle, which shows that Onstad simply and completely lost it. And that Fredy did NOT deserve yellow. (I was really amused by the fact that Fredy seems at first to reach for his face but thinks better of it. I like to think he took my idea of dousing his hands in Beckham’s cologne as a reminder.) I really do think the kid is trying.
2:15, 2:56, 3:08, 3:17, 4:02, I love Kasey Keller
2:30 — time for everybody to curse the Crossbar Challenge. I’m also really impressed by Ianni’s ability to do what hardly anyone else has done this year, and that’s head balls toward goal on set pieces.
3:27 — Montero’s biggest miss of the night. I may be wrong, but it looks to me like if Montero had directed it on target, Onstad would have had it covered. (Probably? He’s so far off his line it’s hard to tell, but I think he would have tapped it wide.) Gorgeous setup, though.
4:08 — I haven’t had nearly enough opportunity to say this during the season, but a very pretty goalbound header by Jaqua off a corner. A lesser goalkeeper might have allowed that one in.
4:28 — This is the foul on Ljungberg that resulted in Jaqua’s “goal” being disallowed. The foul occurs after Ljungberg has already chipped the ball toward Jaqua. Whistle sounds at 4:30, as the ball is in the air about twenty yards downfield and on a downward trajectory directly toward Jaqua’s feet. No telling whether Jaqua would have scored if there hadn’t been a whistle, but this foul should never have been called.
5:15 — from my seat, this really looked like it went in. Sigh.
And that was the game. A lot of opportunities.
If you need cheering up after watching that, you might enjoy this video of another goalkeeper-striker dustup. It’s Chelsea’s Didier Drogba going at it with former Arsenal keeper “Mad Jens” Lehmann. One of my favorite sports moments ever.
![]() |
MLS Forums | MLS Results |
Subscribe
|
Print
|
Share
![]() |
Comments | Add your comment
-



Ah, Dustin’s here to tell us that it’s perfectly okay for a goalkeeper to charge into a player and knock him down in a dead ball situation. He’s a ref, you see, and knows these things.
Anyway, it’s crap like this and the apologists for it that makes it impossible for me to be a fan of MLS generally. If the Sounders don’t make it to the next round, my interest in MLS is done for the year. If that happens I hope I can get a good price for my MLS Cup seats.
Posted from
United States

-



Thanks CarlosT, I am a ref and my official opinion is giving a red card to Onstad in that situation would’ve caused me to Fail my assessment and never work a playoff game again. Further more I’d be lambasted in the press and ridiculed for the rest of the year there is No winning with giving a red card.
You can sit there, and watch the game, and as a Sounders fan say “That’s a red card” because there’s no consequences. When you’re a referee, there’s consequences, especially in Playoffs so you have to be 100% about a red card like that. There’s just no way I could be 100% on that red card, and I guess Salazar saw it that way too.
Thanks for playing Couch Potato Referee with me, I’m ready for it anytime
Posted from
United States

-



If Montero gets a yellow for that, Onstad gets a red. If Onstad gets a yellow, Montero doesn’t get a card.
Any other outcome is bad officiating, and I suspect that there will be “consequences”.
Posted from
United States

-



I must say, everyone in the seats around me thought the keeper should have been shown red when it happened (and before the ref produced a yellow). I can understand taking a conservative approach and just showing yellow, but I didn’t understand Montero’s card at all.
I am attempting to be more zen about the state of officiating in the MLS. I know, it is a hard thankless task, they are just human and I should be more forgiving… But I dont wanna. If I am bad at my job, I am fired. Some of these guys are bad at their job (or hobby – do they get paid? whatever).
I was also wondering if I could sell my cup tickets if the Sounders dont make it. I will stand in the freezing rain for 2 hours for a Sounders game, not so much for any other MLS team.
Posted from
United States

-



Johonna, if the Sounders don’t make it, I think we should hope for the Gals to make the final, because that should inflate the prices.
As for officiating in the US, I don’t expect that it will ever get good because the officials have convinced themselves that it’s not bad. Pay attention to Dustin or the USSF weekly reviews and you’ll see justifications of blown calls over and over again. I think you and I might be particularly spoiled because we’re used to watching Serie A and I think officiating in Italy has gotten really good since Calciopoli shook things up and Collina took charge of the refs. They’re extremely sensitive about calling the game correctly now, and refs who make really bad calls are busted down to calling C2 games, not retroactively justified by any means necessary.
Posted from
United States

-



“Any other outcome is bad officiating, and I suspect that there will be “consequences”.”
I don’t think there will be, he got out even which is really the best way to handle those types of situations. Usually when everyone comes together the two players responsible for the altercation get cards unless anyone does something really serious. It’s one of those gray areas where you only have two eyes and you do the best you can.
Posted from
United States

-



Really Carlos, you’re citing the most corrupt league in the world as having “Good Officiating”. They might be cleaning up their act now but the history of Serie A is pretty damning.
Also I return to my old theory…it’s Serie A one of the top leagues in the world with really skilled players and coaches. They should have really skilled Referees, because when the quality of play goes up, so does the reffing. When the quality of play is bad, the reffing is bad, but everyone just points at the reffing and says that’s the problem.
Posted from
United States

-



Laurie: Thanks for posting this edited video! I had not had a chance to see many of these replays yet, and your comments are spot on. And, I am now chuckling with a smile on my face having watched the Drogba moment. Hilarious!
Posted from
United States

-



Dustin, never stop commenting. I mean that. My comment section is always so much more interesting when you’re here to express a differing (and frequently unpopular) opinion, and I can usually see both sides. It’s much more fun than plain vanilla.
(And that goes for everybody else, too.)
Posted from
United States

-



Dustin, I admire your stick to the guns approach, but so far you haven’t really provided any concrete facts as to why Montero deserved a yellow or why Onstad should NOT have been thrown out. For me it was an extremely aggressive, violent and unprovoked action on a dead ball and I don’t see any particular reason why a red card would be viewed as a “mistake.” A veteran like Onstad should know better and despite his reputation Montero did nothing to embellish it… the only person who embellished was actually Onstad who went running out of the pile holding on to his face like a little girl. MLS should fine him.
Posted from
United States

-



Well to be fair Steve Montero’s initial reaction was to grab his face and try to get Onstad the red. The thing is the referee looking at this sees two things. Onstad bumping Montero and then his eye is drawn away to Montero folding his legs, which doesn’t happen when you’re bumped you just fall over, and then grabbing his face. The refs eyes go from “Wow that was bad, why did Onstad do tha…..Are you Serious Montero?”
I have to be honest, on the Big Soccer Referee forums the refs seems split. Some count it as Violent Conduct and he should be sent off. While others don’t and say a red would do a disservice to the game. I’m firmly on the side of not giving a red in a Playoff game unless it really does go to far. In this case I don’t think the players even thought it went to far, and certainly Salazar didn’t think that.
So if some refs are confused…I think the Rave Green Tinted glass effect is enough to have everyone simply not agree with me and that’s fine. Or should I say the “Fan” effect because a lot of Houston fans think it should’ve been a red too.
Posted from
United States

-



Dustin, do all US referees have reading comprehension as weak as yours? Because that would go a long way towards explaining why they have such a problem with getting the Laws of the Game right here.
Yes, I am citing Serie A, specifically since the corruption was laid bare and the world’s best referee ever took over as the referee supervisor, which any middle schooler would have derived from my earlier comment.
As for your theory, I call BS. You called Serie A “the most corrupt league in the world” in an effort to discredit the idea that they have good officiating. Then you claim that they have good officiating because they have good players and coaches. You’re contradicting yourself. And anyone following Serie A can tell you that the league had bigger stars before the scandal than after. If your theory of reffing held water, the quality of reffing should have gone down after Calciopoli, not up.
No the real difference between here and Italy nowadays is that when refs make bad calls in Italy, they’re officially criticized and potentially sent down to ref lower leages. Here their bad calls are justified after the fact by the USSF. So the standard of reffing here stagnates at best and more likely deteriorates. All your comments prove, time and time again, that we can expect no better.
Posted from
United States

-



I’m sorry Carlos, why don’t you tell me what Law of the Game Onstad broke?
The quality of reffing wasn’t the problem because the mistakes on the field weren’t the problem. There was deliberate actions being taken by referees to ignore the laws of the game in favor of one team or another. That really has nothing to do with the quality or skill of the referees. That has to do with certain referees being cheats.
You’re pleased that Serie As corruption was laid bare…ok that’s hardly a reason to celebrate. It would be much better if there was no corruption. I’m confused though must be my poor reading comprehension but are you saying that the USSF is corrupt and that hasn’t been laid bare yet?
So if I seemed like I was contradicting myself I wasn’t trying to. I was trying to point out that the league was corrupt not that the referees are bad because of that. I was espousing the theory that referees get better with better games to officiate.
Bad Games = Bad Refs
MLS = MLS RefsPosted from
United States

-



Regardless of if the ref should have or shouldn’t have pulled out the red card during the game… this type of offense needs to be punished. We can’t have MLS turn into some punk league. Players need to be held accountable for that crap! He shoves Montero in the previous corner… then takes him down in the next. Fine Onstad and serve him with a min. of one game suspension, if not more! Talk about embellishing… love the air punch that takes Onstad out, caught with multiple camera angles. What a jerk!
Posted from
United States

-



What this comes down to for me is exactly what DaveS said: You can’t give Onstad and Montero the same punishment. If it’s yellow for Onstad, it’s nothing for Montero. If it’s yellow for Montero, it’s red for Onstad. Anything else is a travesty.
Posted from
United States

-



You know, Dustin, I was being a little snarky when I called your reading comprehension into question, but now I see it really isn’t a joke. It’s apparently so bad you can’t understand things that you yourself have written. What Law did Onstad break? Let’s try Law 12, Sending Off Offences, Violent Conduct, as you mentioned in your comment at 3:28 pm.
As for Serie A, why shouldn’t I celebrate the fact the corruption was laid bare? Should I prefer that it remain hidden and unaddressed? Of course it would have been better for there to never have been any corruption, but without time travel, that’s not going to happen. In any case, that’s a complete red herring because I was specifically speaking of the current situation, which isn’t corrupt.
As for USSF and the refereeing corps, no I don’t think they’re corrupt like Serie A was before Calciopoli; I think they’re incompetent and self-satisfied and therefore will never improve above their horrible standard.
Referees in Italy are better than referees here because they are held accountable for their bad calls. Make a particularly bad call and you don’t get to work Serie A or even Serie B anymore. If a referee makes a bad call here, then the USSF will simply rewrite the rule in the weekly review and nothing will happen to the ref. That’s what makes good refereeing, not the quality of the players. What the hell does the fact that Zakuani can’t finish to save his life have to do with the fact that Salazar can’t recognize violent conduct? What does the fact that Jaqua has a horrible first touch have to do with the fact that Salazar doesn’t know enough to play advantage with the ball sailing toward the opponent’s goal and a player making a run?
Your theory is an extremely lame excuse and symptomatic of the attitude which guarantees that reffing in the US will forever suck.
Posted from
United States

-



Carlos how did you think this was going to end? I don’t think it’s Violent Conduct, you do. Did you think by being snarky you were going to convince me?
Also insulting my attitude and saying it’s the problem with American reffing is an insult to how hard I work. Don’t insult me about the job that I work so hard at and care about, that’ll really piss me off.
Posted from
United States

-



Laurie I agree with you, my only thinking is that Montero did something before Onstad which he reacted to. Other than that I think it was mostly because all the players came together and Montero was seen as an instigator.
Posted from
United States

-



Dustin, I wanted to echo Laurie: don’t stop posting here.
You provide an interesting perspective. I want to make clear that I don’t have any illusions that I would be a good referee… I wouldn’t. I just disagree with you on *some* of the officiating in this match.Posted from
United States

-



Oh, gee, Dustin, I’d never want to upset you, now would I? That would be unthinkable.
Go ahead and be insulted. American refereeing is crap and your “theory” is a massive cop out that relieves the refs and USSF from all responsibility. It’s all the players’ fault, the poor refs can’t call Violent Conduct or Advantage unless they’re reffing a top league like Serie A.
I have to agree with other commenters, though, your comments are enlightening. I used to have at least a modicum of respect for refs in the US, and after reading what you have to say, I have none.
Posted from
United States

-



This is one of the rare instances where I’m not in agreement with Carlos.
On the other hand, Dustin, I’m a little unclear about what you mean when you say that the quality of the refereeing is limited by the quality of the play. Same game, same rules, regardless of who’s playing. So…?
Posted from
United States

-



DaveS. I’m glad to be here…and disagreeing with me is a good thing. I’m most likely going to side with the officials and you’re going to have your own opinion about it. The truth is I’m sitting on the sidelines not knowing exactly what I’d do if I was reffing this game. I say what I’d do, but I really can’t know can I?
This is just the sort of conversation that interests me, so I like to have it, some interesting ideas come up and makes me think about it more. Thinking about soccer when you’re not reffing it is a surefire way to get better at reffing it when you get back out on the field.
Posted from
United States

-



Well Laurie I know that when I started out I used to referee adult games. I was 14 and they were 30 to 40. They had pretty bad games, and I wasn’t a very good referee when I transitioned from doing those games, to doing Premiere games. The more really high quality games I did though, the better I got at the job. There are certainly tons of other circumstances at work but I think there’s a lot to be said about when there’s better quality of soccer you get better quality referees. Just from the referees seeing all different sides of the game more clearly and the demands being higher on them in those games. It’s my personal theory, when I do better games more often I become better, because my in Game thinking is much faster and more clear. It’s less…read manual, do what manual says, and more of Feeling out the game. That’s why I think Salazar was better off giving a yellow to Onstad, you could make the case about Violent Conduct, but managing the game and the players is what makes a good referee, not following a book blindly.
Posted from
United States

-



So what you’re saying is not so much that poor players make it hard to ref well (which is what I read in your first comments.) But rather that top-level games make a referee step up?
If that’s the case, perhaps an exchange program with a higher-level league might be in order? Wonder why they don’t do that?
Posted from
United States

-



I just want to say I love Kasey Keller too, and that Drogba vs Lehmann video made me giggle like a little girl.
Posted from
United States

Read the rest of the comments
Leave a Reply
If you have not commented here before, please take a moment to peruse ourCommenting Guidelines.














